As part of an extensive interview with Time Magazine, former President Donald Trump expanded on what abortion access would look like in the United States in a potential second term. Trump laid out a dystopian vision where pregnant women could be placed under state surveillance and then subjected to criminal punishment for any transgressions.

During an April 12 interview, Trump was asked if he was "comfortable if states decide to punish women who access abortions after the procedure is banned." Trump responded that, if he were to win the presidential election, "states are going to make that decision" and "states are going to have to be comfortable or uncomfortable, not me."

Trump's sanctioning of state-imposed punishment on women who receive abortions is consistent with the views he expressed during an MSNBC town hall in March 2016, during his first run for president. 

"Do you believe in punishment for abortion, yes or no?" host Chris Matthews asked.

"There has to be some form of punishment," Trump replied.

"For the woman?" 

"Yes," Trump said. 

Following a firestorm of criticism, Trump released a statement reversing his position. If "any state were permitted to ban abortion," Trump said, "the doctor or any other person performing this illegal act upon a woman would be held legally responsible, not the woman." But now, eight years later, Trump has flipped his position again. He now believes states can hold women legally responsible for receiving abortions. 

This is no longer a hypothetical question. State legislators in Louisiana introduced a bill that would make a woman receiving an abortion subject to "the same criminal consequences as one who drowns her baby." In 2022, a Texas woman was charged with murder for inducing her own abortion, although the charges were later dropped. 

In the Time interview, Trump was also asked if "states should monitor women's pregnancies so they can know if they've gotten an abortion after the ban." Trump said he believed some states "might do that" and, if he were president, the decision on whether to institute surveillance of pregnant women would be up to "the individual states." 

Analog surveillance of abortion clinics has been used by abortion opponents for years to restrict and discourage abortion access. But digital surveillance deployed by the state — including data from period tracking apps, search engines, and license plates — could make these tactics far more powerful. Poland instituted a near-total abortion ban in 2021 and then created a database to track pregnancies. The move has "terrified" Polish women, according to abortion rights advocates in the country. 

Trump refuses to say whether he will ban abortion pills

Trump has also dodged questions about whether he would attempt to impose a federal ban on abortion pills. During his interview with Time, Trump said that he’d make a statement in two weeks on whether his administration would be enforcing the Comstock Act – an 1873 law that makes it illegal to mail “obscene, lewd or lascivious” materials. But 18 days have passed since the interview, and Trump has still not said what he plans to do.

Currently, abortion pills are the most common way pregnancies are terminated. But their wide adoption has made them a primary target of anti-abortion activists. Project 2025, a blueprint for Trump's second term, declares that abortion pills “the single greatest threat to unborn children.” The document explicitly calls for the White House to “rescind FDA approval for the abortion pill” and encourages the CDC to “collect data about who had abortions and where — and punish any states that refuse to share that information.”

The Project 2025 plan also advocates reviving the Comstock Act, which has essentially been dormant since the 1930s. Legal experts say that “the law could be marshaled to ban all abortions—even in blue states that protect abortion rights—and possibly even contraception and gender-affirming care, while circumventing the democratic process.” In fact, Trump allies have indicated that they’re eyeing the Comstock Act to institute a backdoor abortion ban in lieu of a national abortion ban passed by Congress. 

Already, the anti-abortion movement has begun to deploy this tactic. In February 2023, 20 Republican Attorney Generals warned Walgreens and CVS “that federal law – through the Comstock Act – criminalizes the mailing of medication abortion.”

Anti-abortion advocates are also using the Comstock Act to challenge the Food and Drug Administration’s approval of mifepristone – an abortion pill used in roughly two-thirds of all U.S. abortions. The case was heard by the Supreme Court last month, where conservative Justices Samuel Alito and Clarence Thomas “repeatedly invoked the Comstock Act” during arguments. Alito, in particular, “rejected the Biden administration’s argument that the law is obsolete.” 

Trump will not rule out signing a national abortion ban

Trump's primary talking point on abortion is that the issue should be left to the states. But Trump was asked four times during the Time interview if, as president, he would veto a national abortion ban, Trump declined to answer. In other words, he is leaving the option open. 

Trump insists such a bill would never reach his desk. He claims that any national abortion ban would be filibustered by Senate Democrats, and there would never be 60 votes in the Senate to overcome a filibuster. 

But the filibuster rules can be changed with a simple majority vote. Republicans have already shown a willingness to do. In 2017, Republicans changed the filibuster rules to allow for the confirmation of Supreme Court nominees with a simple majority. One of the reasons why Supreme Court confirmations are so important to Republicans is the central role that the court plays in shaping abortion law. If Trump became president and Republicans gained control of the Senate, there would be immense pressure to change the filibuster rules and send a national ban to Trump's desk. 

Trump declines to say if he will vote to invalidate Florida's six week ban 

A law banning abortions after six weeks takes effect today in Florida, Trump’s adopted home state. Signed into law last year by Governor Ron DeSantis (R), this law is one of the strictest abortion bans in the country. During the Time interview, Trump said that he “thought six weeks is too severe.” But he declined to say how he plans to vote on an upcoming abortion ballot measure in November that gives Florida voters, including Trump, the chance to restore abortion access in the state.

“I don't tell you what I'm gonna vote for. I only tell you the state's gonna make a determination,” Trump said after being repeatedly pressed by the interviewer.